Sex, Love, and Addiction

Restarting Your Sex Life with Dr. Pat Love

Dr. Pat Love is known for warmth, humor, and her practical and research based wisdom. Her work has taken her around the world to help people understand and improve their relationships through just about every platform including magazines, TV, blogs, and workshops. Today, she talks about the inspiration she gains by new research and information in the field, how she brings couples together when there have been many years of distance and the formula for desire and true passion. She also gives a formula for passion and intimacy, the strongest predictors of longevity in relationships and the three key elements that make up real life trust.   TAKEAWAYS: [1:28] Dr. Pat Love has numerous amount of blog posts, You Tube clips, trainings and workshops that have made her a renowned relationship consultant. She is also a distinguished professor, licensed marriage and family therapist, and long-standing clinical member and approved supervisor in American Association for Marriage and Family Therapy. [4:26] More research is coming out everyday to support the evidence that being there for each other during not only the fun times, but the tough ones as well is one of the main keys to a healthy and fulfilling relationship. [5:42] Many of Rob’s clients struggle and wonder how they will be sexual with their partner after there has been a betrayal. [7:11] One of Dr. Love’s motivations for writing her book Hot Monogamy was to dig in and process how to feel intimacy again when there has been a betrayal. [9:21] There are two pathways to desire, there are autogenic and psychogenic. We often stereotype all women to be “brains” and men to be “body” in term of desire, but it is more like a continuum. [11:58] The formula Dr. Love came up with in Hot Monogamy is P(passion)=S2i (two sexual beings joined by sexual intimacy). [14:21] One of the strongest predictors of longevity is emotional regulation, the ability to calm, soothe and cheer yourself no matter what is happening. [16:16] The three steps to build trust: Say what you are going to do; Do it; Repeat steps 1 and 2. [18:09] Infatuation lowers our defenses, and the desire and brain chemistry cocktail leads us to focus only on the positive instead of processing negatives. [19:55] The all too common phase of “I love you, but I’m not in love with you” isn’t always something to break up over. Often times, it presents a critical moment where the infatuation has passed and you are at the threshold of true love. [23:56] Dr. Love adapts her model and teachings based on the current research and information, and Hot Monogamy will be updated to reflect the digital age. [28:47] Dr. Love shares her experience of getting her hormones checked and taking testosterone for a couple months. She saw that all the sexual cues that related to her desire were screaming at her under the influence of 1 cc of testosterone. [32:34] The discussion of “chore play” is important for taking the time to relax, and block out some time to create desire.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Dr. Pat Love Hot Monogamy: Essential Steps to More Passionate, Intimate Lovemaking by Dr. Patricia Love @Pat Love facebook @DrPatLove twitter pat@patlove.com   QUOTES: “The good thing about what we do is the research keeps going out.” - P “You will never have passion without intimacy” - P “There’s a limit on how many chandeliers you will hang from, but there is no limit to intimacy.” “Vintage love, tried and true love, makes infatuation pale by comparison.” “I’m halfway between genius and stupid.” “If I even think about patting my husbands butt, I do it.” “Sex takes some work if you want a healthy sex life. You have to be proactive.”

Understanding Millennials and Porn Addiction with Gabe Deem

Gabe Deem is a strong voice when it comes to the issue of porn addiction, and his passion and drive helps offer encouragement, advice and support to both men and women during the recovery process. Today, Gabe shares his work and drive behind Reboot Nation, a free online community with over 11,000 members that helps addicts and their partners overcome problems related to porn use. He and Rob also talk about the ways that he educates himself to stay current on the subject, his own story of porn use and the dysfunction it led to, and interest in the neurochemical processes behind addiction.   TAKEAWAYS: [1:32] Gabe became dependent on porn and developed porn-induced erectile dysfunction (PIED) at the age of 23. [2:42] Early on in Gabe’s recovery, he wanted to go straight to the source and educate himself on porn addiction. He thought there was no better way than to go to those leading the discussions, hence why he attends conferences to get in the conversation in order to share awareness and help future generations. [3:46] When it’s articulated in a simple way, young men and women can see just how large an effect a stimulus like porn can have upon our sexuality. [5:07] Reboot Nation does have a separate section for women, and Gabe seeks to provide a safe space for women to meet their needs. [7:23] Gabe considers himself recovered, rather than an addict. [9:44] In his work, Gabe finds that most men that developed youthful sexual dysfunctions were exposed to porn at a very early age. He was looking at porn since age 8, and that was a crucial factor in his conditioned response to arousal. [12:09] What really started to change things for Gabe was when he dove into the neuroscience behind porn addiction and sexual conditioning. [14:12] Rob’s “cheesecake theory” explains that if you eat cheesecake everyday and come to expect it, your brain is going to wire itself to really not want broccoli, plain toast, or anything but cheesecake. [15:58] Gabe considers himself pro-education, not anti porn. He considers his message empowering, and gives people hope with the message that it is possible to regain their sexuality and steer themselves towards a healthy sex life. [22:41] Gabe and Rob seek to bring the two different populations of porn addicts and sex addicts together, and realize that although they require different treatment, one can help the other. [24:05] Although Gabe didn’t feel personal shame for watching porn, his chronic use through adolescence led to opportunity addiction, where he rewired his brain to a point that led to sexual dysfunction. [26:19] VR is going to bring a whole new experience into the world of porn and addiction. [26:38] Gabe shares his own personal story on his experience with porn dependency and dysfunction. [28:32] The porn induced ED test is an important gauge to gain clarity on where the dysfunction is rooted in. [30:48] Gabe encourages everyone to seek professional help if they think they need it, or if they are having trouble going through the Reboot. [34:13] Reboot Nation has a section for partners of porn addicts as well, and hopefully coming soon a section for professionals to learn more.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Reboot Nation @GabeDeem @Reboot_Nation Addicted to Internet Porn with Noah Church AASECT Your Brain On Porn Sexual Compulsives Anonymous Paula Hall Reboot Nation YouTube   QUOTES: “I think people are responding to the practical information that we didn’t have growing up.” “When you bring people together that have a common problem, they are really motivated to support each other.” “The knowledge of the potential of rewiring your reward circuit at a young age is something I think everyone should know of.” “I found out that my pursuit of internet porn actually ended up taking the one thing I thought it would give me - sexual pleasure.” “The common misconception is that a porn addict is a 40 year old virgin in their mother’s basement. I was completely the opposite.”

Addicted to Internet Porn with Noah Church

Noah Church is an expert, recovery coach, speaker and author of Wack: Addicted to Internet Porn,  and evolution of the porn addiction treatment world. Today, he talks about the difference between addiction and dysfunction, his own personal experience and struggle with porn addiction, the ways porn and sex addiction differ, and what he is doing to make a difference.   TAKEAWAYS: [2:12] Noah himself began using porn at age 9. At 24, he realized how much of a negative impact his porn use had on the rest of his life, and knew he had to seek help and change things around. [3:41] In both porn and sex addiction, there is a stigma to fight, and people that need support. In sex addiction, Rob has seen a deep early trauma, and a pervasive intimacy disorder that affects their dating life and general ability to function in any sort of healthy relationship. [5:51] Noah has the perspective of someone that both has gone through porn addiction, and someone that helps others recover in their own struggles. [9:25] When Noah was 18 and in his first long term relationship, he experienced difficulty with sexual intimacy and what he would later learn to be was porn induced erectile dysfunction. The pattern repeated up until Noah had graduated from college, and he confronted the issue and recognized it was something he needed to leave behind. [16:53] It was when Noah watched Gary Wilson’s TEDx talk on “The great porn experiment” that he began an understanding of recovery and a light at the end of the tunnel. He began sharing his experience online, and even shared his experiences with his romantic partner. [21:54] If you were exposed to porn in an excessive way before puberty, it’s going to cause damage. Fetishes typically develop around ages 9-11. [25:25] Noah sees a blurry middle between a sex addict and a porn addict. Some of his clients have a primary porn addiction which has escalated into engaging in destructive sexual behavior, and some have never had sex. [28:12] Virtual Reality porn will present a whole new host of issues and challenges in both porn and sex addiction. While VR may be more addictive than the state of porn now, we will have to wait and see how it affects real life intimacy. [32:37] Only 20 states in the nation offer sex education, and of those 20 states, 12 require parental permission.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Wack: Addicted to Internet Porn by Noah B.E. Church The great porn experiment | Gary Wilson | TEDxGlasgow Your Brain Rebalanced Addicted to Internet Porn   QUOTES: “Over time, curiosity became compulsion, and it began to replace my drive to actually connect with the people in my life.” “I didn’t have any trauma that led me to pornography, but the pornography led me to trauma.” “It’s not about what you are looking at or how often, it’s about how it’s affecting your life as a whole.” “Addiction thrives in isolation and secrecy. It feels good to break down those walls.”

Mother Hunger with Kelly McDaniel

Kelly McDaniel is an expert on women and addiction. Her deep empathy in the field helps women find, develop and be okay with themselves despite the trauma that may have occurred in early attachment. Today, she speaks about her upcoming book “Mother Hunger”, the lasting patterns that emerge due to early trauma, and how Mother Hunger treatment is different that typical sex and love addiction treatment.   TAKEAWAYS: [1:04] Kelly McDaniel, LPC, NCC, CST, maintains a private practice in Nashville, where she specializes in the treatment of adults and couples. In addition, she is an EMDR trained therapist and member in the Society for the Advancement of Sexual Health (SASH), and holds an education of an MA from Georgetown University and St. Mary’s University. [1:39] In 2008, Kelly’s first book “Ready to Heal” came out, written for women healing from addictive love and sex. The book kicked off that women needed gender-specific information in a culture that objectifies female bodies and women’s wisdom. [2:38] In 2012, the second edition was expanded to include a chapter on McDaniel’s original term “Mother Hunger​.” Mother Hunger​ is a concept that has assisted both clinicians and clients to identify the origin of addictive relationships and foster the healing process. Currently, Kelly is offering two, three-day therapeutic Intensives for women who are exploring their relational patterns in depth. [5:31] Kelly finds her work resonates with both clinicians and the women that seek help. [7:02] Kelly defines “Mother Hunger” as a form of pre-verbal trauma that occurs in early attachment (5 weeks into conception in utero to age 3) that affects a woman’s belief system, physiology, psychology and relationship capacity. [8:37] A neglected child that is left hungry for connection, touch or love will turn to dissociation, or a freeze state, in order to protect and comfort themselves. [13:32] Our most basic idea of what a good partner would be is deeply affected when we are neglected or abused. When Kelly works with women in betrayal, it is a replay of the original wound and a map of where to go to heal. [17:22] The first ways we take in the world are through our mother’s love and some form of feeding and nourishment. These traumas are related to our most primitive stages of love, and continue to play romantically with both our current day lovers and support system or lack thereof. [20:46] Crisis is when your emotions and intellect is out of balance, and you are so invested emotionally in a situation that you are not thinking clearly. When those who have Mother Hunger get into a relationship, they get weighed down by the emotional need that comes up with the possibility of finally being loved. [21:37] Mother Hunger treatment is very different than standard sex and love addiction treatment. It is more related to the treatment in EMDR and somatic training, and sitting inside the grief for a longer intensive amount of time. [24:04] Women with Mother Hunger haven’t yet built a sense of identity, community or trust within themselves and others. [27:25] We profoundly underestimate postpartum depression and how that affect the ability to give love and nurturing. [29:39] The trauma forms before language, and is wired in to the body as the norm for what the world feels like. [31:30] Women with Mother Hunger transfer their attachment needs to men early on.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Kelly McDaniel Ready to Heal: Breaking Free of Addictive Relationships Mother Hunger Partner Hope Dr. Kenneth Adams Christine Courtois   QUOTES: “There is a huge gap between I am safe and I feel safe that goes into adulthood.” “If your responsiveness from your most important caregiver is impaired from the start, then you don’t even have a sense of what normal or healthy is, because you have never experienced it.” “Our first love is our mother.” “Women gain strength from each other. One of the ways healthy women even tolerate men are with the help of other women.”

Addiction, Impulsivity, and the Commitment to Change with Paula Hall

Since Paula Hall’s work in the field began over 15 years ago, she has seen many shifts in the way we treat and educate surrounding sexual addiction and sexual impulsivity. She is now a leader, and between her own work at The Laurel Centre, her 9 published books and her team of 20 people in growing locations, she is a voice for change and empathy for both men and women struggling with addiction. She talks today about the difference in approach that the UK has towards addiction, gives a sneak peek into her upcoming book Sex Addiction: A Guide for Couples, and what she sees for the future of giving individuals and couples hope and direction.   TAKEAWAYS: [2:09] At a time when she was working in private practice, Paula attended a sex therapy conference and saw there were just a handful of speakers on the subject. Once she saw it was being recognized as an addiction with pragmatic relapse strategies and recovery work, it made sense to apply this model. Since she was familiar in working with the model of drug addiction, she decided to further her training in sexual addiction. [4:08] It took Paula four years to get her first book published, as every publisher she went to said there was no market in sex addiction. [7:55] The US and UK come from different directions in the field of sexual addiction. Awareness of sexual compulsivity and addiction came in America through the lens of addiction. In England, the concept came out of sexology, where sex in all of it’s non offensive forms are considered healthy and normative. In the UK, the 12 Steps are used in chemical addiction treatment, but not heavily for sexual addiction treatment and recovery. [10:56] To Rob, the word “addiction” means access to a lifelong resource of free support, examples of recovery and shame reduction. If we de-stigmatize addiction and the connotations that the 12 Steps must be done in accordance with religion, that may help the negative associations that go along with the treatment. [14:15] In Europe they are more liberal in certain ways, but when you have more choice it brings more responsibility. The challenge Paula sees is one of seeing moderation as prudish and limiting. [16:38] Writing Sex Addiction: The Guide for Couples was the hardest book Paula has ever written, primarily because working with couples is a multi layered and complex experience. There are two people with different perspectives and fractured agenda on the past, present and future. Paula reminds us there are some things you can not compromise on - two examples are values and children. [22:04] Paula uses the metaphor of a ship that has been hit by a tidal wave to describe what happens to couples when there is a betrayal or sex addiction All crew members must scramble to safety, and drag the relationship back to the harbor to assess the damage without creating any more damage. Then, it is hard work and dedication to get every aspect of intimacy back, building it up from the ground floor.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Understanding and Treating Sex Addiction: A comprehensive guide for people who struggle with sex addiction and those who want to help them by Paula Hall Sex Addiction and the Partners Perspective A Comprehensive Guide to Understanding and Surviving Sex Addiction For Partners and Those Who Want to Help Them by Paula Hall We Need to Talk About Sex Addiction - TEDx The Laurel Center   QUOTES: “Conservatism and moral issues in American culture make it so much easier to pathologize or call things sex addiction that aren’t”.  - R “In the UK we aren’t pathologizing sexual diversity, because most of us are trained in it.” “Couples work has been the hardest work I have ever done. There is nothing like the couple with sex addiction.” “If you do really good work as a therapist, you are no longer needed.” “Quite literally, often times one partner finds a freedom at a the cost of their partner.”

Codependence vs. Prodependence with Carol the Coach

Carol Juergensen Sheets, aka “Carol the Coach”, has a passion for understanding trauma, disconnection and isolation, and using her gifts to help both sex addicts and betrayed partners through their darkest moments and into the light of healing. She also loves to use media and broadcasting to spread her message to millions, in a judgment and blame freeway. Today, she talks with Rob about her work in partner focused treatment, her radio show on Blog Talk Radio that receives more than half a million listeners weekly, the concept of blame, guilt and remorse in addiction and the shift she has seen in the field over the past decade. Carol has a deep enthusiasm for her work, and it is apparent in her work as a therapist, coach, media personality or caring member of the community.   TAKEAWAYS: [3:32] Carol has an affinity for disseminating information to the public on a wide scale. Her podcast is one of the oldest, and now has half a million downloads per week. She helps people globally, interviews leading experts and helps colleagues and clinicians gather cutting edge education to bring back in their work.   [7:26] Carol compiled a book in sex addiction, Sexual Addiction: Wisdom from the Masters, that she donated to the American Federation of Research. This body of work served to share the wisdom on a wide range of topics on addiction, compulsion and partner betrayal.   8:16] When Dr. Patrick Carnes appeared on Carol’s radio show, he brought up the notion that suffering and trauma of addiction and betrayal can actually be a precursor for growth, healing and connection.   [9:46] If a partner is acting out and is in a deep and enduring relationship, there is a higher chance they will feel remorse than an individual that is unable to connect. Relationships provide a depth of learning, and isolation continues the process of sexual addiction.   [10:45] It it often helpful for partners to hear that the compulsions and of their sex addict partner started earlier than their relationship. This may help take a large burden of remorse off their backs, and realize they did not cause the behavior and it was present long before their coupling.   [12:18] Carol shares how she noticed a shift in the field around 2007 in how the partners were acknowledged in their deep pain, and not blamed from a model of codependence and causation. She began in to invite them in to her sessions, and realized they needed their own specialized help. She got involved with APSATS, The Association of Partners of Sex Addicts Trauma Specialists, and within a year was training her own colleagues. Partner betrayal is still seen as a deficit area, and Carol supports crisis management both separately AND together between the partner and the addict.   [17:01] Conflict breeds intimacy when partners are able to work through their grief and restore and develop a foundation of safety and stabilization. Once there is full disclosure in the early couples recovery work, couples can begin to work on empathy. The addict must acknowledge the issues, validate the partner’s feelings and reassure the partner that he or she can begin to feel safe. Partners  also must work through their shame, or the blame from others around them from staying with a sex addict.   [21:55] Carol speaks upon an older model that looked at partners with the same need for confrontation as their sex addict partners, even adding the label of codependence. Now, we realize that this is a person in crisis reacting to the betrayal trauma, and they need support rather than blame.   [29:27] Remorse is a natural part of grief, and it is common for the spouse to already blame themselves on some level for their partner’s betrayal. Carol works with her clients on building up their sense of worth and belief that they are deserving of honesty, truth and love.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency APSATS American Federation of Medical Research Your Sexually Addicted Spouse: How Partners Can Cope and Heal Sex Addiction: Wisdom from the Masters Esther Perel Carol the Coach carol@carolthecoach.com Sex Help with Carol the Coach Sex Help with Carol the Coach - You Tube Blog Talk Radio - Sex Help with Carol the Coach Betrayal Recovery Radio   QUOTES: “With sexual addiction and partner trauma, we aren’t going to get as far as we need to go unless we have the research to substantiate what we know to be true.”   “Suffering can be the precursor for post traumatic growth.” “Isolation is at the root of sexual addiction.” “The addict carries the shame, but the partner carries the pain.” - Esther Perel In any coupleship, there are issues that both people contribute towards or contaminate. Sexual addiction is not one of them.” “Connection is the antidote to suffering.”

Love is Everlasting with Dr. Harville Hendrix

Dr. Harville Hendrix is an international expert in the field of human intimacy and human relationships, and is dedicated to teaching individuals what love is in both feeling and action. Today, he talks about the crucial steps in a relationship before love can even enter the picture, and the interesting way our unconscious minds match us with our partners.   He and his wife Helen authored the best-seller Getting the Love You Want, and draw from over 40 years of working with couples to get to the root of how we can be curious instead of judgemental and find ourselves through our relationships. Lastly, they talk about Imago, their work in education and their work helping couples understand each other even in the most painful of circumstances.   TAKEAWAYS: [2:54] Even before love happens in a relationship, there must be a differentiation process where we become aware that our partner is not a figment of our imagination here on this earth to love us in exactly the manners we think are best. Until that process occurs, real love cannot yet be born. [5:07] The highest divorce rate is year 7. [5:54] During courtship and early stages of marriage, partners have a tendency to conform to the “perfect person” for their partner. [6:52] Polar energy is needed for interest, and if we end up marrying the exact same type of person as us, that will lead to a couple feeling disinterested, not challenged and eventually disengaged. [8:52] We tend to unconsciously seek out our partners for the same needs we are looking to find in our caretakers. Caretakers may be neglectful or intrusive, and this absence occurs both in single family homes and intact homes. [10:10] It’s typically about 2 years in to a relationship when we see real differences start to come out, the fantasy is unmasked and the partner is left triggered, confused, and anxious. This need for the symbiotic relationship to be back may often lead to compensatory behaviors. [13:01] If we become curious instead of reactive, that will lead us to really understand our partner, and see both them and ourselves clearly. [16:31] It is a huge loss when couples see the illusion, and walk away from an opportunity. [18:31] 20 out of 50 states have mandatory sexual education in schools, and of the 20 states, 12 require parental consent. [20:17] Dr. Hendrix recounts a story about a couple he met that was from an arranged marriage, and he found they had similar expectations and challenges than a couple that met organically. [24:41] Context is just as important as the self, and what gives birth to the individual. [26:39] Imago Relationship Therapy has been in the culture for 30 years, and is a three step dialog process to help people connect, talk and listen. [32:40] Talking can be the the most dangerous thing people do. Dr. Hendrix is concerned with strengthening the health, safety and dialogue of a couple when he is working with them. [35:06] Learning better relationship and conversational skills is something that can benefit people both in personal and professional relationships.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Getting the Love You Want Harville & Helen Five Stages of Grief Safe Conversations Leadership Training Imago Imago Training Relationships First   QUOTES: “Love has to be love of the real, rather than love of the fantasy.” “There is a collusion to become symbiotic with each other.” “Instead of judgement and criticism, we can shift to curiosity.” “When the energy dies and the love dies, now is the time for growth to begin.” “If you do not feel safe with your partner, you can not connect with your partner.”

Women in Sex and Love Addiction with Staci Sprout

Staci Sprout, author of Naked in Public, therapist and speaker joins the show today to share her experience of over 24 years working with couples, individuals and groups on sex and love addiction. She discusses her current project, where she dedicates her time and expertise to train therapists on how to better work with females, and how to broach different perspectives and reasons for acting out. She and Rob also talk about cultural issues in dating, women using porn and ways people can find connection and love in a healthy and productive manner.   TAKEAWAYS: [2:40] Staci is a gender variant woman and doesn’t fit the typical bell curve profile of a female in recovery. There are certain qualities that have been typically more masculine in a traditional sense, such as identifying herself as an addict in her book Naked in Public. [4:41] Many women hate the term sex addict, and struggle with shame and oppression in society over their sexual identity in the first place. Others will identify with it almost as a badge of honor, which is more rare yet found in the younger generation. [6:31] The majority of female sex addicts tend to act in ways that are more in pursuit of unavailable partnerships, staying in abusive relationships, or other relationship and emotionally driven situations. [7:17] Staci wrote Naked in Public from the perspective of a female addict that we typically see in men. This includes behavior and a mindset leading to casual and unattached sex, typically with many partners. [12:17] The longing for love and connection is so powerful, and we can still be drawn into implicit longing and cravings if these needs are not met. A large part of Staci’s recovery is being able to do what she does consciously, and observe impulses and cravings without judgement or shame. [16:03] A woman that doesn't know how to date the right man isn’t broken, and shouldn’t give up on love. [17:23] One of the signs of mental dis-ease is when your emotions and intellect are out of balance, and you lose the ability to make a good intellectual choice. Having a supportive community that you can share with, is a human and healthy need. [21:44] Our culture is still waking up to the power of attachment, and open to learning new ways of picking partners and finding intimate and meaningful connections.   [25:44] As exposure to porn is getting younger, Staci cites a study where at least 1 in 3 women watch porn every week, and 1 in 10 every day. In an ever evolving technological world, therapists must find a way to factor in online addiction with the human needs in love and sex. [29:02] Rob and Staci discuss what dating is, and what it is not. Hands off, lights on! Enjoying coffee for an hour or two then parting ways is healthy, and part of the forgotten fun of courtship is taking your time to get to know someone.   [32:29] Distress tolerance is good for reclaiming the innocence of dating and vulnerability. Often times people move too quickly or give up on love entirely because of a past bad experience, having no clue how to date in the first place, or having no support to bounce ideas and fears off of.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Naked in Public Staci Sprout Sex and Relationship Healing Live Webinar Staci’s Support Group Marie Claire - How Porn Affects Women’s Lives   QUOTES: “We need to look at our language, and find a language that will help women feel seen, mirrored and valued.” “There’s just not enough female informed approaches, and then women I work with are always educating me.” “We can teach you how to love better, and find communities where you can get the love that you need without having the abuse accompany it.” “Sugar and sex are two of the things that kids have to reach to.” “Not all of us are the best picker. Sometimes we need help picking.” “One of the most important things is who someone lets close to them, both emotionally and physically.”  

Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency with Dr. Rob and Tami

Today on the podcast, Rob and his partner in crime (and healing), Tami explore a new model to treat the betrayed and hurting partners of sexual addicts - Prodependence. Rob has been immersed in the last few years in looking for a new model that moves beyond codependency, and helps to validate and support the partners of addicts, rather than pathologizing and blaming them. His new book, Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency, explains this model and the framework of attachment vs. trauma therapy and changes the lens from confrontational to invitational.   He and Tami answer questions about the formation of codependency in the 1980’s and how it evolved, the issues with the codependency model, explanation of the “crazy” state of an upset partner, and how Prodependence encourages loving in a manner exhibiting boundaries and self care.   TAKEAWAYS: [1:29] Rob’s book, Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency, will be out in September. Rob has been very invested in this topic over his many years as a therapist, including his PhD dissertation on codependency.   [2:06] Q: Why did Rob write Prodependence? A: For the first ten years that Rob was in practice from 1991 - 2001, partners of sex addicts were treated using codependency, the same model that was used for alcohol and drug addiction. This speaks to not just what is going on with the addict, but assumes that a partner’s distress and anger has to do with their own early life experiences instead of the trauma they feel from the addict’s behavior. Codependency says that we are working out and repeating patterns from unresolved relationships.   [3:45] There is an assumption, in the models we have been working with, that the partner is somehow in part responsible for maintaining addiction.   [5:21] Prodependence states that every action a partner or loved one takes - enabling, rescuing, even nagging, is acting out of love. It is the nature of relationships where we are attached, and looking out for our primary bond. When our primary bond is threatened, what seems like “crazy” behavior is really just the partner trying to step up and save their family.   [6:21] Codependency came out in the 1980’s, and became a big pop culture issue during the rise of feminism. It emphasized that partners look at themselves and take accountability, while prodepenence recognizes the partner is going through a major crisis and must be treated for the trauma happening in that present moment for at least the first 60-90 days.   [8:51] When we experience a loss and grieve, we have regrets and remorse as part of the process. It’s natural for partners to blame themselves, rather than realize they have been victimized. There is an emphasis in codependency to look at the partners behavior, and from that, surmise how they enabled the addict’s behavior.   [12:37] Prodepenency supports the proven fact that we do better in life, work and social situations when we have a stable relationship and attached bonds.   [13:35] In the early stages of treatment, it’s important to acknowledge the partner’s suffering and efforts to keep their family together.   [15:35] Q: Do you think that Codependence Treatment as a trauma based model can actually be counterproductive when working with loved ones of addicts? A: The essence of codependency is a trauma based and deficit based model. It says to the partner, you have some problems in the way you love, and pathologizes them to feel wrong and broken for the love they have been trying to show in order to save their family and marriage. Prodependency has empathy for the way they have been trying to love, and supports and teaches them to find a different way.   [21:33] When partners come in to seek help, they often have been lied to and had their suspicions doubted over a long period time. It’s not their early trauma that makes them feel “crazy”, it’s the thought of their whole world being a lie, or getting information that takes the bottom out of everything they have believed to be true.   [24:04] Prodependence says partners act “crazy” because they have been living in a crazy and traumatic situation and living with an active addict who has been lying, cheating and gaslighting them. That’s enough trauma for the first couple months of treatment, rather than spend time focusing on why they may be acting out from their own childhood.   [25:36] Q: Do you think a lot of therapists have evolved away from the true Codependence trauma based work, but have lacked the language to express this evolution, perhaps until now with Prodependence?   A: As the Codependence model evolved in the culture, the emphasis began to grow more on the partner’s responsibility for why their addict partner was acting out. Even though the field has naturally evolved its stance from blaming addicts partners, the only formal model that therapists have had has been codependency.   [28:51] The goals of Codependency for partners to take care of themselves, set better boundaries and love in a healthy way is well intentioned, but demoralizing and defeating as soon as they are blamed or there is something wrong with them.   [33:15] Someone in a crisis needs simple direction, support, validation and hope, which is what the Prodependence model offers.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Prodependence: Moving Beyond Codependency Women Who Love too Much Codependent No More Beyond Codependency   QUOTES: “A spouse will never be responsible for any behavior that an addict does.”   “I don’t believe that dependency is a bad thing. I think it’s a good thing. We lean into the people we love, and fill in each others weaknesses.”   “Partners of addicts are in crisis. People in a crisis need support, direction, education and hope. They don’t need to look at their own issues or history.”   “When this person that you love becomes a life trauma themselves, you are going to be traumatized and be in grief.”   “I don’t think any of us grow up learning how to love into a house on fire.”   “We know that trauma precipitates addiction, but that doesn't’ mean it precipitates addiction in a partner.”   “If you’re a mess, it’s because you’ve been living with an active addict.”  

Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men with Dr. Rob

In today’s episode, Rob digs in deeper on the topic of sexuality and sexual addiction in gay men. He discusses the different norms in gay vs. heterosexual communities, what determines an addictive or compulsive sexual behavior, and the specific challenges gay men have in building relationship intimacy. There are both many differences and similarities in how gay and straight men act out in addiction, and also specific knowledge therapists need to have when working with the gay population.   TAKEAWAYS: [1:39] When Rob entered the field of work in the Sexual Addiction and Compulsion in the 90’s, we were dealing with the height of the HIV crisis. Many of the men that were behaving in unsafe or promiscuous ways were sex addicts, and there were not a lot of educated experts to help them. [3:33] Rob wrote the book Cruise Control in 2003, which is the first and only book of its kind. In 2013, he updated it to include the present-day landscape of certain drug use such as methamphetamines, social media and hook up apps, and marriage. [4:56] Gay men exist in different cultural expectancies and behavioral patterns than the heterosexual population. There is also a lack of cultural validation over time for long-term intimacy building. [5:31] Many gay men have grown up being encouraged to appear a certain way and hide or deny their sexuality. They are already accustomed to having a front-facing presentation to the world of who they really are not, which is also a what sex addicts possess. [6:22] Most gay men don’t get to date in high school and end up repressing their sexuality, so there is a delayed adolescence and they often explore sexuality, relationships and intimacy starting in their 20’s. [7:02] Unfortunately in the gay world, there aren’t a lot of role models for healthy long term dating and relationship building. Younger men often don’t get to see what a healthy gay coupleship looks like, because once gay men find their partners they typically leave the singles scenes and join the paired up community. [8:34] The tendency for males to want to dominate and lead may not produce the same type of synergistic male / female relationship that produces empathy, intimacy and compassion. If two men want to be together, they will have to learn these skills and work on their affiliation. On the other hand, lesbians usually need help with individuation in relationships, as they tend to enmesh quickly in the beginning. [9:54] If an individual is demeaned and devalued for their sexuality, it is natural for them to internalize and act out against it. [11:11] We don’t talk about HIV or AIDS very much anymore, even though we lost 350,000 people before we got medication. The cultural response is almost as if it didn’t happen, and that is something that gay men live with every day. [12:18] Men share common characteristics on how they view sexuality, relationships and intimacy. The traumas that drive straight men to act out sexually are the same ones in gay men. Men are visual by nature, and it’s not unusual for gay men to have body issues, food issues and stresses among their physical image. [13:58] Gay men act out in similar ways as straight men, whether it’s a hookup app, webcams, a club, or a one-night stand. Grindr has been helpful of taking gay men out of dark alleys and put them on the same dating and relationship ground as heterosexuals. [18:03] The #2 leading addiction problem in America after opioid addiction is ChemSex. It’s difficult to compartmentalize what pieces belong to the sex addiction, and what pieces belong to drug addiction. Recovery from meth and sex addiction is a long and challenging process. [20:34] In treating gay male sex addicts, it is imperative for the therapist to know the lingo and how gay men view sexual experiences, not pathologize, and know that they will most likely need to learn intimacy. They will need guidance on finding places, hobbies activities to go to where they can grow their community, receive peer support and build their skills without being sexual. The therapist must be open to many non typical therapy topics such as sex toys, threesomes and open relationships. [23:04] Many times gay men believe part of being gay is having many sexual partners and experiences. That may be the case, but doesn’t have to be true for someone that is relationship and commitment seeking. [24:55] In the healing process where heterosexual and gay men are both present, the men bond together as men, rather than necessarily around sexualization or homophobia.   RESOURCES Sex and Relationship Healing @RobWeissMSW Sex Addiction 101 Cruise Control: Understanding Sex Addiction in Gay Men Shame Grindr The Urge to Merge   QUOTES: “Being a gay male who is a sex addict, it’s a difficult thing to identify, own and work past because of the cultural issues that are involved.”   “There are fewer cultural boundaries for potentially excessive sexual behavior among gay men.”   “Most gay men already know how to do that (have a front facing presentation of themselves that didn’t fully show who they are) because they grew up hiding their sexuality.”   “Homosexuals have not had the 2-3000 years of relationship building experiences and skills, because it has never been acceptable.   “Being a gay woman or man means you live in a subculture that is exposed to extensive cultural, legal, and religious oppression directly related to your sexuality.”   “It all adds up to the same thing if you are an addict - that hole in the soul that never gets filled up and you are always running looking for a rescue.”